Sen. Dan McGee – I Don’t Like It So I’ll Change Our State’s Constitution
by jhwygirl
Perhaps some of you saw AP reporter Kahrin Deines’ story, today, in the Missoulian?
Glaring out to me in her reporting of Sen. Dan McGee’s foolish SB80 and SB81 bills that are working through the Senate was this statement:
No Democrats voted for either of the bills.
Now, while that statement, in and of itself, is accurate, it infers that it was a partisan vote and it deflects the truth – that there were Republicans that didn’t support the bills either.
Vote tabulations for SB80.
Vote tabulations for SB81.
What SB80 does is submit to the voters of the state an amendment to Article X, Section 9 of the Montana Constitution that have the members of the state board of regents of higher education elected instead of appointed by the governor, in overlapping terms.
SB81 does the same for the state board of education.
Which Republicans didn’t vote for the bills? Well, on SB81 (voted first) the following vote “Nay”: Sen. Rick Liable; Sen. Terry Murphy; Sen. Jim Peterson; Sen. Don Steinbesser; Sen. Bruce Tutvedt; and Sen. Ryan Zinke.
Not quite the partisan vote the Missoulian article would lead you to believe?
Then, on SB80, held a short 24 minutes later, former gubernatorial candidate Sen. Roy Brown, Sen. Jerry Black, and Sen. Rick Ripley were added to that list of “Nays” above.
Added.
Why newpaper reporters get lazy and don’t analyze the vote better before they make a blanket biased statement like Ms. Deines did, I don’t know.
SB80 and SB81 are bad bills. We shouldn’t be changing our constitution to suit a short-term whim or a certain agenda. My lord – we had Elaine Sollie Herman running for State Superintendent – and even more scarier, she got 201,091 votes. By contrast, Denise Juneau, who won, got 234,483 votes.
Scary.
A 2/3 vote of the entire legislature is needed to get this before the votes. Frankly, I doubt the voters would approve – and why waste the money?
Beyond that, what true conservative would propose, advocate or vote for a bill that works to amend the state’s constitution? That seems like a pretty unconservative type of thing to do, if you ask me.
A third reading in the Senate will occur on Monday at 1 p.m.. Take time to contact these Senators listed above and thank them for their “Nay” vote – and let them know that changing our constitution is not something that should be taken lightly, for the whim of political desires.
You may also call the Session Information Desk at 406-444-4800 to leave a message for as many as five legislators per call. Your message will be delivered directly to the legislators. The TTY (Telephone Device for the Deaf) number is 406-444-4462.
The Session Information Desk is open from 7:30 a.m. to 5 p.m. Mondays through Fridays and from 8 a.m. to adjournment on Saturdays.
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February 1, 2009 at 2:38 pm
Hey, if the media can report that because 11 democrats joined the republican cartel in a carte blanche against the stimulus, and the republicans declared that made it a bipartisan vote, then why can’t this vote be framed as bipartisan?
Did you say the article was written by the AP and printed in the Missoulian? Oh, nevermind.
February 1, 2009 at 4:17 pm
I don’t recognize the name, so it’s a safe bet the writer doesn’t give two shits about Montana. I know its hard for people to believe around here, but most people don’t.
Fro and I were talking about this the other day because its not unusual for people to say, “How do you not know about Montana Event from 2005 X?” And I’m like, “I dunno man, I was in Cali. Between 3rd grade geography and the point when I got a call from Missoula, I completely forgot Montana existed.”
Not defending, mind you, just externally rationalizing.
February 1, 2009 at 5:26 pm
On one hand, I hear ya klemz – on the other hand, I’m betting Ms. Deines fancies herself a journalist, collecting a paycheck and all.
Reporting the facts is a basic element of journalism, no?
The thing I don’t get – and you’ve stated before about those that don’t “give two shits,” so I have to ask: How can you or any one of the “most people” you refer to do that? Is that your sense of civic responsibility? I’ve never met a journalist that didn’t have one – and I’ve never met you, either – but how do you do that? I spent a number of years formally studying journalism, and there wasn’t anyone in there that didn’t give a shit.
Beyond that – maybe that is what is wrong with journalism today – the people doing it are just doing it until they get the next best job?
I just don’t see how you (for example) can be here in Missoula to write about Missoula and Montana and do the best of job at it when Missoula is entirely dispensable to you.
February 1, 2009 at 5:30 pm
Well said Jhwygirl.
February 1, 2009 at 6:34 pm
I second that, Elanor.
February 1, 2009 at 6:37 pm
I’m not sure, you’d have to ask a career journalist, but I’ll take a poke…
Why does a passion for a place have to drive somebody? Why not a passion for water issues? Or energy issues? Both of those Montana is rich in. Maybe someone can really envision living in Seeley Lake or Columbia Falls, but needs to put some time in western Montana’s only real job market? Maybe someone takes pride in the quality of their work and that’s motivation enough?
The primary difference between journalists isn’t passion, it’s writing ability and critical thinking skills. If this stuff were hard, there wouldn’t be bloggers.
February 1, 2009 at 7:17 pm
Yeah. ‘Cause we bloggers are a bunch of idiots.
February 1, 2009 at 8:17 pm
Today, in the Bozeman Daily Chronicle, the editorial tells the city that they should cut employees from 40 to 32 hours a week, which would save 25% of personnel costs.
I’ll leave that there for you “idiot bloggers” to contemplate, as you reflect on the critical thinking skills and inflated self-righteousness of the print professionals and the inerrant logic of their blathering obfuscation.
And don’t get confused by, say, the fact that the health insurance premium would still be at 100% whether at 40 or 32 hours, no, that would require the critical thinking editors to leap forward in their logic, no, just reflect on what one quarter of 40 hours might actually be…
February 1, 2009 at 8:36 pm
geez, klemz you been gettin’ all up in our face for a week now…did somebody piss on your brand new shoes or what???
February 1, 2009 at 8:40 pm
Did the reporter do anything wrong here? She wrote a factual statement describing the vote. Is there anything wrong with the Democrats’ votes here? I don’t see anything.
Frankly, I think we vote for too many down-ballot offices in Montana (although voting for offices like Board of Public Ed makes more sense to me than voting for clerk of district court).
February 1, 2009 at 8:45 pm
As I said, Matt, it implies a party-line vote. We’ve got enough acrimony up in Helena – reporters shouldn’t be presenting something as party-line when it wasn’t. At least IMHO.
February 1, 2009 at 8:48 pm
should say “as something that implies party-line..”
February 1, 2009 at 8:51 pm
My opinion too, jh, especially when it’s factually incorrect.
February 1, 2009 at 8:58 pm
It’s the media feeding that beast of controversy.
February 1, 2009 at 9:06 pm
*Suddenly transforms into Kevin Spacey sitting in the back of the squad car at the end of Se7en*
I didn’t do that.
February 1, 2009 at 9:19 pm
guess i didn’t see that particular movie… does persecution complex play a part in it???
you are the one who sailed in here flying your colors about how hard it is being a journalist, so skip the obtuse BS Klemz and say what you really mean to say…
the stuff i do is certainly foam but i think j-girl does more to inform the public about important issues than all the print media combined in this town….care to expound?
February 1, 2009 at 9:57 pm
I was responding to the Bozeman Chronicle bit, but I wondered when the psychoanalyzing would begin.
J-girl does a fine job. I wouldn’t come here, read and post if I didn’t think this site does a good job chewing the fat. (And to answer your question, being a journalist is hard; journalism is not hard. If I could have an anonymous handle, I’d be having the time of my life, so maybe jealousy is the real pee on my sneakers).
That’s all beside the point, though. Take a look at how all of this began. Who fired the first round?
I don’t get why someone can’t say something truthful about Missoula without the cavalry returning full charge. This place is beautiful, but I’ll be damned if the job market doesn’t blow. The rivers are clean, as is the air, but the University is probably too easy to get into to be taken seriously on a national level. The mountains are full of trails, but the arts scene is full of nothing. In the end, Missoula is nothing special, but simply the most livable place in the middle of a vast expanse of specialness.
…Oh, the Griz are a division II football team. I have to throw that one out there.
By the same token, nobody cares what happens here. Maybe they’re missing out on something, but tell me what’s so libelous about that sentence in and of itself?
I could psychoanalyze too about the cause of this argument, which came as a surprise to me, but it wouldn’t do my persecution complex any good. My mountain bike and I are perfectly happy for the time being.
February 1, 2009 at 10:19 pm
well said mr klemz and your article on gambling was also very good. stay happy. we need all the good journalists we can get. when you have lived in missoula for awhile longer perhaps the passion for place will also occur, but i also recognize that not everyone is dependent on place for happiness or success.
bears just like the fact that wilderness beckons close by from all four directions and i have lived in places that did not inspire me nearly as much. this place and these irascible tough-minded montanans willing to fight for what we believe in regardless of our differences, it is hard for me not to appreciate this place and all the people in it when i see the passion that it inspires.
February 1, 2009 at 10:37 pm
” … the arts scene is full of nothing,” says klemz. You’re going to catch some crap on that line, and rightfully so.
Sure, we’re not New York, or even Seattle or Minneapolis, but for a city this size we have an incredible arts community.
This just off the top of my head (and I’m not even an arts aficionado):
Missoula Art Museum
Galleries at the University of Montana
Missoula Symphony
International Choral Festival
The wildlife and documentary film festivals
Missoula Community Theatre (and a host of other theater groups)
First Friday (or whatever it’s called these days)
Quality musicians and venues up the wazoo
I mean, you can’t swing a dead cat around downtown without hitting an artist, many of them extremely talented.
You’ve opened up a can of worms here, klemz. I’m betting I’ve just scratched the surface and there’ll be additional posts listing all the art activities I’ve missed.
February 1, 2009 at 10:47 pm
Sorry I didn’t say that right away, JacksonHighway-girl, but, well… I’m kind of a jerk — just not as much of one as I come off in print.
To get back to the point before the Archduke’s assassination, the author is not a Helena familiar, so I’m not sure if she’s filling in or completely new to the bureau. Considering the article was literally a brief, I think it’s fine from a factual standpoint. I doubt this was the biggest thing that happened that day.
And Helena doesn’t need any feeding. That place is downright silly.
February 1, 2009 at 10:59 pm
“the most livable place in the middle of a vast expanse of specialness”
That’s pretty special to me.
February 1, 2009 at 11:01 pm
“when you have lived in missoula for awhile longer perhaps the passion for place will also occur”
Actually, the passion for place usually occurs after one moves away, and misses what they once had here. And that is what drives people back for the final settling in.
February 1, 2009 at 11:13 pm
The mountains are full of trails, but the arts scene is full of nothing. In the end, Missoula is nothing special, but simply the most livable place in the middle of a vast expanse of specialness.
Drivel like that makes you sound like a Rusty or Big Swede. Your comments are often flippant, useless, and arrogant. Why don’t you move on to a bigger market if this town is so disposable to you? You’re thinly veiled bitterness indicates you have probably tried, and failed.
Why does a passion for a place have to drive somebody?
If you haven’t already, maybe you should read some Wendell Berry, or Edward Abbey, or Richard Hugo. Place matters, Klemz. I suspect your editor would probably agree with me.
February 2, 2009 at 7:48 am
Of all the useless things I read, one commenter psychoanalyzing and mind reading another has to top the list. I don’t tale klemz’ comments or person as anything like described above…nor rusty nor big swede either. Conversations need wise crackers and alternative points of view, and if you’re not used to them, or don’t value them, then your conversation circle might be too small.
We’ve had the discussion about the sorry state of journalism before, and I may not have pointed out that editorials are absolutely the worst. They’re not checked for accuracy and opinions given are likely to be based on “what the average joe reads in our paper”, yes that IS a quote.
That leaves the paper, ostensibly responsible for providing more information to the average joe than he has, merely compounding the confusion.
It’s the intentional mistakes, such as the one I cited, or the one jh cited, that misstate the facts to bend the story to a particular message, that is particularly of note.
Blogs do feed of the traditional media, although jh provides plenty of independent content here, they also serve a purpose and place to call out the obvious bias in the reporting/commenting.
February 2, 2009 at 8:57 am
Came from a bigger market, Lizard. And why is none of your business.
February 2, 2009 at 9:49 am
everyone gets a turn to roast on the rotisserie here, eventually. then we laugh about it. that is what i love about this place.
February 2, 2009 at 10:03 am
Matt Singer: “Frankly, I think we vote for too many down-ballot offices in Montana”
Wow. Never thought I’d hear the Chief Executive Officer of Forward Montana say something like that. Weren’t you guys just attacking the GOP for trying to purge voters, using statements about local control, grass-roots involvement, and all that other stuff?
I guess the emperor really isn’t wearing any clothes.
February 2, 2009 at 10:24 am
I think our freedoms will still be safe if we’re deprived the right to vote on what color collar Schweitzer puts on Jag. Limited resources; many battles to fight.
Choose wisely.
February 2, 2009 at 11:49 am
In ravalli county, there is a tough time had filling alot of these local advisory boards. Some of them are a tough fight in the zoning disputes that have a say in land use and water issues, so I support the public having more say in who gets on these local boards. If you’re trying to keep local ag going, its doubly important. The more local control the better. We’ve got too many industry stalwarts pulling the levers and not even thinking about the consequences.
Go michelle landquist!
February 2, 2009 at 12:09 pm
I don’t care why you’re here, Klemz, or where you came from. As a writer and sometimes artist, however, I do care that a journalist from our local weekly can flippantly disparage this town, university, and artistic community so easily. I find that very discouraging.
February 2, 2009 at 12:25 pm
Oh Lizard, why you no like me? I think you drift toward the pedantic sometimes but you remind me of somebody I used to work with and it makes me smile.
If you’ve got beef with something I’ve done then say it, but don’t waste my time calling out the color of my pom poms. I do strictly in-depth news and state/fed policy stuff, so why does it matter anyway?
For Christ’s sake guys, I’m not Gov. Schweitzer. If I had a family or a medical condition I couldn’t even afford to be doing this. Now can we move on?
February 2, 2009 at 2:33 pm
Klemz, no need to draw or presume fire from someone who lacks the motivation to do so. Inviting a pack of wolves into a fight among lizards doesn’t seem like the best defense; just deal with the lizards and let the wolves deal with the elephants.
February 2, 2009 at 3:58 pm
lizard- went ahead and spammed the preceding false lizard comment and erased your comment telling us about the false lizard so it wouldn’t look weird….will look into who that was…
February 2, 2009 at 4:02 pm
Nuh-uhh. I know wolves have a fondness for Kaufmanesque shtick, exspecially when the marmots are running into the slough and the horned toads head for the burrows. How many species of reptile are native to central Asia? Two, apparently.
February 2, 2009 at 4:08 pm
Klemz-when my fur got singed last week i consoled myself that at least it is only a virtual roast as opposed to a real one…
February 2, 2009 at 4:19 pm
I ain’t mad, bear. To quote the greatest member of your genus, “Don’t pick the prickly pear by the paw, when you pick a pear, try to use the claw.”
February 2, 2009 at 5:07 pm
Thanks, problembear. One obnoxious reptile is enough.
February 2, 2009 at 5:24 pm
this may be a dysfunctional family site where we occasionally break all the furniture but we try to do the right thing by each other here, lizard. sure beats the lock-step right wing conservative sites where everybody is required to tow the party line. we try to keep it exciting around here….but fair.
February 2, 2009 at 5:46 pm
By the way, UM is fine for what it is. The whole “world-class institution” thing just makes me wonder, uhhh…. which world?
February 2, 2009 at 10:50 pm
Klemz, the Lizard and the wolves are not friends and are not connected in any way.
February 5, 2009 at 12:21 pm
By the way Klemz, Goofing off online per Kaufmanite antics is one thing. Taking yourself so seriously that you’ll sell out your friends and people who trust you at any opportunity is totally different. You may hate missoula, but missoulians who know you may come to hate you too. That’s through no fault of Kaufmanite antics; it happens only through betrayal and very high levels of something the uber-sophisticated refer to as a kind of sell-outedness.
February 5, 2009 at 12:51 pm
I don’t hate Missoula, and said person can call me if they have an issue. It wasn’t my intent to call anyone out. I just thought someone posting was somebody else in real life who was messing with me for comedic purposes. Not to be mean… just to be nice.
Chill out.