Rob Natelson’s Solution For Rape-Tolerant UM Campus: Guns

by lizard

For those who want to see the rape-tolerant culture at the University of Montana addressed in a meaningful way that will lessen the risk of loved ones being sexually assaulted, former UM professor Rob Natelson claims to have the solution

The first problem identified by the professor is the admittance of those who aren’t “college material”. The unsubstantiated correlation being made here by the former professor seems to be that admission standards are partly responsible for sexual assaults:

As a former long-time University of Montana employee, I’m not surprised somehow by the sexual assault problems on campus. When you admit (for athletic, political, and financial purposes) a lot of students who really are not college material and concentrate them together, you invite problems. The most common result, of course, is that most UM undergrads never graduate, thereby wasting their own time and cash, and the taxpayers’ money. But the same admissions policies are, at least in part, responsible for even nastier results.

Does the professor offer anything to back up this correlation between aptitude for higher learning and the potential for rape? No, he doesn’t. Instead he just marches on to the next idiotic solution: guns.

Here is Rob’s numbered suggestions to solve the problem the University of Montana has had with sexual assault:

(1) Do what the Colorado legislature has done and allow anyone with a concealed carry permit to possess and carry guns on campus.

(2) Also allow students and faculty who have successfully completed a university-sponsored firearms safety course to possess and carry guns on campus.

(3) Hire Gary Marbut of the Montana Shooting Sports Association to organize the training, with special emphasis on his Handguns for Women course. Encourage as many female students, staff, and faculty as possible to take the course so they qualify to carry on campus. Give female students PE credit for the course if you have to.

(4) Watch the creeps shake in fear when they even THINK about assaulting a woman who might be packing a weapon and knows how to use it.

I have a hard time believing someone who is suppose to be intelligent enough to teach at the college level actually thinks carrying concealed weapons would be an effective means of addressing the rape-tolerant culture that currently exists at UM.

According to the National Institute of Justice, 85-90% of sexual assaults reported by college women are perpetrated by someone they know. How is a gun suppose to stop these assaults?

Another factor often involved in sexual assaults on campus is alcohol. Again, for someone who is significantly impaired from alcohol, what good is a gun going to do to stop a sexual assault?

In my not-so-humble opinion, Rob Natelson is being an opportunistic asshole with his idiotic post advocating for carrying concealed weapons on campus. This is not some partisan opportunity for a think-tank hack to shill for the gun lobby. This is a much larger problem that won’t be solved by simply arming women with handguns.

By the way, Rob, why a “handguns for women course”? Do women really need some specialized course to learn how to operate a handgun just because they’re women?


  1. Swede Johannson

    If 90% of sexual assaults are committed by women then how come these rapists aren’t rotting in jail?

    Poor judge of character perhaps? Bad lay?

    • Steve W

      ?

    • DS

      Do you have reading comprehension problems?

    • Swede Johannson

      Didn’t proof read.

      Should have read, “If 90% of sexual assaults are REPORTED by women then how come these rapists aren’t rotting in jail?”

  2. lizard19

    I want to cross-post a comment I put up at ECW. I’ve had a bit of a back and forth with Dave Budge over Rob’s post, and my inability to control myself (by calling Rob a “fuckwad”) resulted in my comment being deleted, which is very understandable. here is the comment (not the one that got deleted):

    Rob needs to back up his claim that admission standards are in part responsible for the multiple alleged sexual assaults with something more substantial than just his say so, and he needs to explain how carrying a gun will stop the majority of rapes
    that occur where the victim has some familiarity with the assailant.

    or he can just allow you, Dave, to police his thread for the mean things angry people like me say about him.

    there is not one link in this pathetic post to indicate the professor spent any significant time actually thinking this through. I’m glad Laura was able to call him out in a manner that, I would hope, does not get ignored, since she did not call him any unsavory names that require deletion.

    Dave, I think you know this post is worthless. if the professor doesn’t back up his assertions, then I think it will be clear that even he knows it’s worthless as well.

    the victims of the rape-tolerant campus culture at UM deserve better than a former professor exploiting this issue to toss some red meat to the gun nuts who think shooting and killing the problem is the best response.

    I don’t expect Rob to respond to me, either there or here, because I don’t think there’s anything he can say to back up his weak assertions.

    but I’ve been wrong before, and maybe there is some lingering integrity Rob would like to preserve by acknowledging his post was a shallow, insensitive, unsubstantiated pile of crap that does nothing to further the critical task of making the UM campus and our community a safer place for young women to learn and grow and prosper.

    I’m waiting, Mr. Natelson…

  3. lizard19

    I also think the comment I mention, from Laura, needs to be cross-posted here as well, because she makes some great points that deserve serious consideration, so here it is:

    Yes, when a university admits people who are immature and unable to act responsibly that does pose problems: social, legal, ethical, personal, and educational. Tightening the admittance criteria can alleviate those problems to a degree. I agree that a university should value students who are academically competent but this has little to do with the issue of rape.

    To think though that stricter admittance criteria will decrease rapes does not follow logic. Rapists come in all forms. Some are highly educated, upstanding members of the community, and well-liked. Others are the complete opposite and still others fall somewhere in between. To judge a persons rapist-tendencies based on university admittance criteria is the same as judging a persons moral character by the cleanliness of their home- there may be a slight positive correlation but neither causes the other.

    Secondly, the person who suggested that because SOME rapes are by unknown attackers, SOME do not involve alcohol, SOME would be avoided because unknown assailants would fear a gun and therefor justifies gun carrying is not quite thinking this through clearly. Well yes this seems true on the surface I highly doubt it would be to a such a significant event as to eliminate the majority of rapes. Rapists target vulnerable women and unless a woman has her gun easily accessible- many rapists will target a woman who they are able to physically overpower and the victim would not be able to reach for her gun. Should an attack occur, there is now a weapon involved in which the attacker can use it to further coerce his victim and/or USE it in a state of heightened emotional arousal(not talking sex there). The addition of a gun in these situations as well as alcohol fueled situations does not bode well for positive outcomes.

    Perhaps a better solution to ending rapes is not reactionary but rather preventive. Teach women how to defend themselves. A self-defense class makes a wonderful fitness elective. It should teach not just how to physically defend yourself but also how to keep yourself safe in ways such as walking with a partner, requesting an escort, watching alcohol consumption, and other traits. The school should have a strong policy for investigating and addressing reports of assault and should have strong consequences for those involved and then ACT ON THE POLICY.

    The best thing we can do to end rapes though is this: teach our young men from an early age to respect women. Teach both boys and girls to stand up for others when they see something happening. And avoid the culture in which young men cheer each other over every sexual conquest and try to get the most notches in their bedpost; treat sex as something shared and not just a personal satisfaction and suddenly men will start thinking of their partners involved and not just their own satisfaction. A lifetime of habits and moral integrity can head off a number of disasters.

  4. e

    off topic grandma bong youtube clip deleted —lizard




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