The Usefulness Of Gun Extremism
by lizard
Alex Jones made some headlines for himself recently by going berserker on Piers Morgan. While I can’t stand Alex Jones, the self-promoting carney of conspiracy culture didn’t disappoint his followers with his antics. And while Piers Morgan sat there, trying not to react to Jones’ aggressive goading, I bet he was thinking—this is great, I don’t even have to argue my points because this guy is making my case for me by acting like a lunatic.
Here’s the video:
For a good analysis of Alex Jones’ statements, Benjamin Studebaker takes the time to address them, one by one.
Another video that I ran across features a youtube dude who calls himself “marked guardian”, a guy who likes to walk around with an AR15 strapped to his back so he can test police officers:
I wonder if the police officers would treat this kid any differently if he wasn’t white.
I’m not particularly qualified to discuss guns. I do, however, recognize the difficulty pro-gun people are going to have in advocating for their side when all manner of gun-nuttery will be used to ridicule them.
And there is plenty of gun-nuttery to choose from. One example is in today’s Missoulian, with an article titled ‘Patriot’ Group looks to create armed community. If you are interested in becoming a part of this rightwing, counterculture community called The Citadel, there is an application process:
To win residency to The Citadel, applicants would have to agree to a list of conditions, such as following the U.S. Constitution, and being able to shoot a man-sized steel target at various distances with a handgun and rifle.
Members must keep an AR-15 semiautomatic rifle handy, along with at least five magazines, 1,000 rounds of ammunition and other supplies. Stocking provisions for one year is also required.
“The responsibility for maintaining functional arms and ammunition levels for every member of the household shall fall to the head of household,” the application form reads. “Every able-bodied Patriot will be responsible for maintaining a Tactical Go Bag or Muster Kit to satisfy the Minuteman concept.”
The group says it won’t have a leader. There will be no home ownership fees, no “recycling police” and no ordinance enforcers from city hall. Homes would be poured of concrete, the website says, to achieve maximum strength.
A rational conversation about guns won’t be easy in this country. Hell, a rational conversation about anything seems increasingly difficult.
Will gun extremists ever understand how useful they are for the gun control side of the argument? Doubtful.
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January 12, 2013 at 9:37 am
I am truly frightened by these developments, liz; and have little hope that mass shootings and lawlessness will end…
(the rest of this comment was deleted -lizard)
January 12, 2013 at 10:06 am
I understand the concern. I was personally threatened by David Burgert before he shot at deputies and disappeared into the woods. it was incredibly unsettling, though at the time I didn’t know who he was.
there was also concern at the time our local Occupy encampment was active that a few extremists who shall not be named were casing it out. luckily nothing came of that threat.
we live in troubled times, to be sure larry.
January 12, 2013 at 7:45 pm
Lizard, I am greatly amazed that you condone and entertain this libel. I ask that you remove Kurtz’s comment.
January 13, 2013 at 7:38 am
in the mind of some pro-gun extremists, every mass-shooting is an opportunity to promote their vigilante fantasies of shooting and killing bad guys. embracing vigilante justice is tantamount to embracing lawlessness, and I do think that is what some—not all—gun enthusiasts want. I don’t see the libel, Craig.
January 13, 2013 at 11:33 am
To claim, as Kurtz, did that I or anyone that thinks like me hope for mass shootings is, in fact, libel because it is false and is published here not as mere reckless opinion, but as a statement of fact and blessed by you. I am not a public figure.
January 13, 2013 at 11:48 am
I excised the part of the comment you feel libeled by.
January 13, 2013 at 6:02 pm
Thank you.
January 13, 2013 at 12:07 pm
Fuck you, Craig for believing you are the only Moore on the globe: it’s pure psychopathy. Besides, your comments in public fora that celebrate violence against those with whom you disagree have singled you out as a intolerant bigot, an earth hater and a blowhard.
January 13, 2013 at 6:04 pm
I am sorry you are having a bad day. Perhaps tomorrow will be better for you.
January 12, 2013 at 12:28 pm
I think Alex Jones is a professional disinformationist. His job is to make gun owners, big pharma critics, and 9/11 researchers look as bad and nutty as possible.
He’s good at what he does.
January 12, 2013 at 12:55 pm
You’re right AJ is a nut and 9/11 truther, which puts him in the same class with Mark T.
Say what you will about nuts there’s enough sane discussion in the new media to send at least the “assault weapons” part of new regulations packing.
“According to the New York Times, the administration’s prospects of pushing an assault-weapons ban through Congress are slim and, as a result, the White House “is focusing on other measures it deems more politically achievable.” The story suggests that the White House doesn’t want to spend political capital on “a losing cause at the expense of other measures with more chances of success.” Though the administration will recommend the passage of such a ban, it’ll be a hollow recommendation. The White House is already defining success downward, “emphasizing other new gun rules that could conceivably win bipartisan support and reduce gun deaths,” which would include universal background checks and research into the causes of gun violence.”-NYT.
January 14, 2013 at 5:02 pm
Steve W. hit it on the head. Jones may be a twoofer but he is a gun bator and a birther too just like you swede.
January 12, 2013 at 1:10 pm
And to say the only nuts are pro gunners is being disingenuous.
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/jack-coleman/2013/01/11/latest-ed-schultz-whopper-weve-never-had-civilian-stop-shooting
January 12, 2013 at 1:19 pm
no where in this post do I say “the only nuts are pro gunners”.
January 12, 2013 at 9:11 pm
The Usefulness Of Anti-Gun Extremism.
Sound better with my link?
January 13, 2013 at 7:42 am
the usefulness of anti-gun extremism is increasing profits for gun manufacturers.
January 13, 2013 at 8:48 am
Never mentioned “profits”.
January 12, 2013 at 1:34 pm
It looks like these Citadel folks are looking for acreage in Idaho or Montana. I think they’d feel more at home in Idaho (hope, hope).
January 12, 2013 at 9:13 pm
Thank goodness there’s Shapiro’s out there than Jones.
January 13, 2013 at 7:51 pm
FYI from 2009:
Now does that make Montana’s Dem senators extremists because they oppose legislation that bans certain firearm cosmetics?
January 14, 2013 at 5:23 pm
News reports warning of large numbers of people planning to flood into Idaho or Montana to join the armed Citadel is nothing more than sensationalism masquerading as serious journalism. It makes a great headline, fans the paranoia of the left and helps sell newspapers.
Go to the bottom of the Missoulian article. The Southern Poverty Law Center rightly states “….the claim that there are several hundred people involved is patently ludicrous” and “idle fantasy” and “we’re likely talking about a man, a dog and his computer envisioning this whole imaginary city. We don’t take it that seriously.”
While the Missoulian, to their credit” mentioned these comments at the bottom of the article, many of the news sources left it out to help sensationalize the story.
As for Piers Morgan, this sums him up rather well:
January 14, 2013 at 5:35 pm
Hey buddy, even one more Derek Skees moving up here is one too many.
January 14, 2013 at 6:13 pm
we should always be weary of how hot-button issues get reported, which is why this post featured that article as an example of how gun-nuts will be used in precisely the manner you describe—to fan paranoia.
Pogo, you don’t seem to like sensationalist reporting when it comes to an issue you support, which the sensationalism may negatively affect. that was precisely my frustration during the medical marijuana debacle, which prompted this post.
back to the gun issue. as you point out, this Citadel “community” is not a serious thing. unfortunately, by virtue of this story being written, these particular nutjobs are getting free publicity, and it could become a serious thing.